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This is your place to publicly comment on the topics and issues addressed in Speaking of Faith programs. React in a personal way, and put into words what this program meant to you.
Submit Your Reflection about "Spiritual Tidal Wave: The Origins and Impact of Pentecostalism."
Regarding Aimee Semple McPherson (May 2, 2006)
I was amazed at the content regarding Aimee Semple McPherson. "Sister Amy," as she was known, was a media sensation in the 1920s. Her 32-day disappearance, alleged kidnapping, in 1926 was a national scandal, involving allegations of torture, drugs, and white slavery. While obstruction of justice charges against her were eventually dropped, many eyewitnesses claimed they had seen Ms. McPherson and Kenneth G. Ormiston at various hotels during the period she was missing. This incident is widely believed to be an early example of the grand tradition of religious sex scandals. Would you have reported about the PTL Club without mentioning Jim Bakker and Jessica Hahn? Would you tell the story of TV ministers without mentioning Jimmy Swaggert's taste for prostitutes?
Barry Johnson
Apple Valley, MN (KNOW, 91.1 FM)
Who's Really Allowed to Sit at the Table (May 1, 2006)
As someone who grew up in a Pentecostal church in the Boston area, I must take issue with the idea that this religion promotes democracy. Sure, as far as personal salvation goes, yes, all equally require it, but that alleged egalitarianism doesn't apply to day-to-day living on Earth. The rhetoric of unquestioning obedience to church mores and to authority was always running neck and neck with exhortations to embrace God's love (or else!).
More specifically, in the early 70s I noticed that my youth-oriented, Bible study material was discouraging my generation not to fight for temporal rights on Earth because we are supposed to be "citizens of Heaven." And they cited Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob as examples of God's people who supposedly realized this fact and therefore allowed themselves to be ripped off by their enemies. So who benefits from this kind of rhetoric? Powerful people in corporate boardrooms and government who hate the idea of organized labor or anything else that intrudes on the bottom line. Therefore, I feel your portrait of Pentecostalism or any "old-time religion" in general as "democratic" or "multicultural" was a bit misleading. Next time, please look beneath the veneer of big street celebrations filled with music and dancing by people of all ethnic groups and see who has a voice at the table and who doesn't.
Dana Franchitto
South Wellfleet, MA (WCAI, 90.1 FM)
Equality/Inequality (May 1, 2006)
John Gibson of New York has spoken for me in his reflections. I listened with great interest to this revealing program, but would loved to have seen more balance. "Equal before God" does not include gay people and does not include people of other faiths, so here was that upsetting ring of hollowness — noble lines and no humility in realizing their hypocrisy.
Liz Kay
Baltimore, MD (WYPR, 88.1 FM)
So Could Moses Have Been Pentecostal? (April 30, 2006)
Your perceptions and Professor Robeck's observations on individual experiences by people on the margins of established institutions, prompted thoughts about what kinds of environments best spark ecstatic experiences, and the extent to which such individual experiences engender reform, rebuilding, and rededication in a community. The heroic journeys of history and legend are consummated by returning to within the circle.
Ralph Palasek
Arlington, VA (Listens to SOF OnDemand)
Making Me Very Nervous (April 30, 2006)
The level of conservative, primitive religious fervor displayed by these folks makes me very nervous. Like the radical Islamists, they have no doubt in their world view, which is some kind of simple revolt against the increasingly complicated world described by both science and the world media. Their concentration on the "signs of the Apocalypse" (and yearning for that event) are particularly frightening because this nation, in particular, has multiple capacities to actually create an apocalypse that will destroy life as we know it on this planet. Of course, we won't have to suffer the result long for their lack of personal discipline, after the plagues, holocausts, and environmental disasters wipe out the futures of their (and my) children. That's a lot to risk on a Big Rock Candy Mountain in the Sky fantasy.
Thomas Day
St. Paul, MN (KNOW, 91.1 FM)
Found Myself in Tears (April 29, 2006)
I have spent my entire adult life studying religion as a puzzle of the intellect. The demythologizing of Bultmann, the historical Jesus of Perrin and Crossan, the ultimate concern of Tillich are still my models of religion, which I am proud of. But, your program on Pentecostalism caught me by surprise. At the end I was in tears hearing the young man from New Zealand speak in sweet tongues, knowing for the first time how precious that speaking was to him and those like him. Thank you for this rich experience. I shall not forget it. Perhaps you could do the same with Mormonism some day? There are grand adventure there too — cowboy prophets and new scripture in a perpetually open canon?
Mark Thomas
Holladay, UT (Listens to SOF OnDemand)
Taken Aback at the History (April 29, 2006)
Personally, I found this episode of Speaking of Faith to be extraordinarily interesting. This is because I was raised in an Assembly of God church. I also attended an Assembly of God college for two years, so I've heard all of this history before, but not to this extent. I thought that this "religious revolution" was an incredible event, although there have been a lot of negative connotations ascribed to Pentecostalism, all-in-all I think that it's a great tradition.
I don't necessarily agree with all of the views of Pentecostalism, but I think that these denominations have something that is very special, as do all religions and denominations, but personally, I have been very positively effected by Pentecostalism. Growing up I remember hearing people "speaking in tongues" and seeing people dancing up and down the aisles of the church as we sang these very up beat praise songs.
The part of this program that I found the most interesting was hearing about how the racial groups of people split after the meeting at Azusa Street. This really disappoints me when thinking about Pentecostalism in general. It's absolutely absurd that different ethnic groups couldn't worship together. I know that the church that I grew up at was not a part of this part of Pentecostalism. There was almost an equal amount of black and white people. I also remember going to North Central University (right here in downtown Minneapolis) and being shocked that there were so few black people. NCU is not racist in any fashion, but I remember asking a professor why there were so few black students and he proceeded to tell me about Azusa and how the black and white people split off, the whites were the Assembly of God and the blacks were the Church of God in Christ. I was almost ashamed to be a part of a belief system that originally didn't permit black people to be a part, this is because my family has adopted some children three of which are black. I guess, it's not a problem anymore, at least not in any Assembly of God church that I've heard about, but nonetheless I was taken aback.
Daniel O'Brien
Crystal, MN (Listens to SOF Podcast)
Pentecostal "Equality" (April 29, 2006)
Listening to your program on Pentecostals this morning, I was struck by your theme of exceptional equality embodied by the worldwide Pentecostal movement. You said one of their key tenets was "the equality of believers before God." Pentecostals are anti-gay. They do not believe that lesbian, gay, bisexual, or transgendered Christians share their so-called "equality of believers" and Pentecostals bar LGBT people from ministry, mission, and many of the gifts of God, of course including marriage.
As your program emphasized, Pentecostalism is a global movement affecting societal change wherever it is established. Pentecostals pass along their anti-gay religion in places where institutionalized homophobia needs no help. Indeed, Pentecostals in Africa, Asia and South America, not to mention Europe and North America, are often in the forefront of the religion-based persecution of gay Christians. I write as a Christian myself, and I've never had a personal agenda or association with Pentecostalism. I just felt the glowing, indeed, almost fawning appreciation you presented of worldwide Pentecostalism and it's "equality," at best, turned a blind eye to its active homophobia.
Finally, I am hardly an expert, but I believe you might want to get a clearer picture of the equality of women in Pentecostalism "on the ground" in places like Nigeria for instance. I would urge you also not to brush past the millions of lesbian Christians worldwide in your rush to salute gender "equality" among Pentecostals. Thanks for listening. It's just that "equality of believers before God" increasingly seems only to mean something to God, not God's people.
John Gibson
New York, NY (WNYC, 93.9 FM)
This Clarified My Thoughts (April 28, 2006)
I have been a regular listener of Speaking of Faith for about a month now and this programme was illuminating to me, because from my foreign perspective "Pentecostalism" was a very blurry term. I had only heard of it in conjunction to its influence in Latin Americans and the practice of glossolalia. I did not know what this term meant, what the term was describing. Now I feel I have a better view of what the movement is and was and perhaps will be. I thank Speaking of Faith for showing me the positive and the negative sides of this movement. This helped me clarify the borders of the three terms "Evangelical," "fundamentalist," and "Pentecostal" and will probably shape my thoughts on religion in general for a while now.
Tessy Wieme
Ludwigshafen am Rhein, Germany (Listens to SOF OnDemand)
Open to God (April 28, 2006)
The Pentecostal movement has so much to offer and does a lot to include people into the expression of their religion (vs. the worship lead/performed in some of the more formal churches). I was involved with the Catholic Charismatic Renewal movement as a teen in the 1970s and grew away from it when there was a sense (and statement) that those participating in the movement were the ones that were saved — and implied (if not stated) that those not participating were not saved. I believe that God/Holy Spirit is more open than that and being one with God is open to each person in their own means and according to what they need if they are open (open themselves) to God.
Luke Rheaume
O'Fallon, IL (KWMU, 91.7 FM)
Awestruck (April 28, 2006)
I'm awestruck about the Pentecostal movement. Two things from this program stuck out the most to me. First, the amount of people that identify with Pentecostalism is overwhelming. I had no idea there were so many people around the world involved in this movement and it is definitely changing religion everywhere. The second part that I found so interesting was how diverse Pentecostalism is. I can see why Cecil Robeck said it was a religion that appealed to people in the margins. Being a part of this movement must be so spiritual and uplifting. Thank you for opening my eyes to a movement I knew so little about.
Robyn Quist
St. Michael, MN (Listens to SOF OnDemand)
Based on Emotion (April 28, 2006)
As a former Pentecostal member and now an ordained minister I can confirm that the reason it is popular is because it is based on emotion and lots of false promises with Assemblies of God and other denominational preachers not having the skills to teach "servanthood before rulership" as in Matthew 24 parable of the talents. The weakest pastors are Pentecostal and the most unfruitful members of the body are his members.
Glen Mauro
Wall, NJ (Listens to SOF OnDemand)
Mystery (April 28, 2006)
My comment/question had to do with the highly popular Nicky Gumbel's Alpha Course from his Anglican base in the United Kingdom. Mainline Protestants and other Christian denominations are hosting this rather ecumenical 10-week introduction to Christianity. There is a Pentecostal flavor and a brief reference to the Toronto Experience in it. You might consider Rev Gumbel for Speaking of Faith.
And now a poem about faith:
Credo
Who is in charge?
Who designs and creates?
I worry when someone sees no mystery,
has it all intelligently worked out for me.
Do I believe in God?
Why yes I do, but you may not agree,
And want to know — whose god, how big?
How many are there — one or three?
I take this mystery to ponder
not in laboratory or Congress
But with hearts and minds
in temples.
Darwin comes again
headlines shout evolution
God says "how clever"
Gordon Prickett
Aitkin, MN (KBPN, 88.3 FM)
Cults, Sects and Religions (April 28, 2006)
I was listening to Krista Tippet speaking with Carrie Miller this morning and one of the telephone callers asked whether the Pentecostal movement had been considered a cult and was now transitioning into a "real religion." The issue is often touched upon when educators look at the evolution and role of religion in history. It was fascinating to me when I recently learned more about the historic role of religion in social structure. I was surprised that it seemed quite logical.
The theory is that all belief systems arise from and are constructed around the needs of the communities. Historically, these communities were obviously smaller and more isolated but now include national as well as global and cross cultural communities. New needs continually arise as we transition to survive. Transitions occur as a result of the responses required to address real or perceived differences and/or discoveries. Two examples would be: when crop cultivation and the domestication of animals allowed us to move from a hunter-gatherer society to an agrarian society; or the advent of the Bronze Age allowed us to have more advanced tools and weaponry. Systems then need to be put into place to accommodate these new realities. These will necessarily be required for our behavioral responses, but as we are Homo sapiens we must adjust our belief systems as well.
From an analysis point of view, at their best, religions offer a society a way to process information from the past and the present, deal with the questions about the nature of life and death and then function in a healthy manner supporting the existence and growth of the community. It is a given that there will always be some sort of a pre-existing belief system in place. Then there must be a catalyst for the change. Something or someone will cause this belief system to no longer be or appear to be functioning in a way that serves the community or is acceptable to its leaders. Someone will be then become "prophetic." The word "prophet" takes its origin from the Latin word prophétés (meaning spokesman or one who speaks beforehand. Pro-, "before" + -phétés, "speaker"). The spokesman offers up a message relating to the nature of the required change or the problematic or transitional issue. This is clearly heard as a separate voice from the status quo or current belief system. Often, as change tends to be hard to grasp, the spokesman is considered to be difficult, oppositional, or even of enemy status whether or not they come from within the immediate society or culture.
As people are informed and transition into believers and/or converts, the small or single separate voice becomes larger and more viable. The enlarging group then becomes a sect, cult, or separate movement etc. depending on what the message constitutes and how threatening it appears to be to the reigning or competing system. At first the original system may tolerate the difference of opinion, but as the voice/beliefs become more powerful they must reject it or transform themselves as it begins to threaten the status quo. So the new entity dies or becomes more viable.
If this new entity expands, some form of organization or hierarchy will necessarily appear. As something grows and becomes larger, there evolves a need to manage and monitor communications and activities so that it remains a cohesive force with a commonality of ideas and actions or it can dissolve into chaos. As people start to share their own interpretations of information, ideas must be processed and then again be integrated or rejected based on some pre-agreed set of criterion or a new oppositional voice or splinter group will start to form. If the new sect, cult or movement etc. continues to grow and gather additional converts, it is then required to have even more organization. When this new belief and operational system becomes a somewhat standard way of perceiving information and dealing with the world and includes enough followers, it then has impact on the world or a part there of, and must be acknowledged.
The status of religion is then achieved. By its organizational nature and integration into the society, the new religion won't be able to include oppositional or fringe elements (unless it makes provisions to include in its system a place for extremists or other cutting edge thinkers in some venue or another) and the process will begin again. So in this case: sect, cult, ideology, etc. will move into religious status if accepted. When I understood this, I was quite amazed as I had pondered this among other religious questions for quite some time and could not believe that it could be that easy to understand.
Merrill Wheaton
St. Michael, MN (KNOW, 91.1 FM)
A Day of Revelation (April 28, 2006)
I am a 60-year-old white, married, female. I went to Catholic schools through high school, then to the U of M. Like many in my generation, I spent some years trying to fit the religion I learned into my life. I finally found I could do that at a liberal (and wonderful) Catholic church — St. Joan of Arc in Minneapolis. It's strong mission of inclusion and social justice is exactly right for me. Two weeks ago I signed up for a talk being given at church tonight by Matthew Fox, author of Original Blessings and many other books.
I was so excited when, in my car around noon today I heard former VP, Walter Mondale, on Midday. His topic was "Balancing Faith and Politics". Everything he said resonated with me so completely. Then, after leaving the Matthew Fox talk tonight, I turned on MPR and found Krista Tippett being interviewed! It was particularly unnerving when she was explaining about Pentecostals because as she described their worship as being full of feeling, not rigid, people moving to the music, (and speaking in tongues), it was almost exactly the kind of worship Matthew Fox was talking about as he described the place of worship he has in San Francisco! Honestly, the whole day felt like "deja vu"! I feel as though this was all information I needed to hear and it needed to be pounded into my head for full impact. Anyway, thank you for your production of "Speaking of Faith". I think you provide a valuable piece of information. Thank you!
Sue O'Brien
Arden Hills, MN (KNOW, 91.1 FM)
Unique and Exquisite Accomplishment (April 27, 2006)
I started listening to the Speaking of Faith programs as an assignment for a college class, but I cannot convey how impressive I find them. Kudos go to Krista Tippett, and staff, for their extraordinary journalistic investigation — it is abundantly appreciated. This week I think they have outdone themselves. I found the "Spirtual Tidal Wave" program to be especially marvelous and enlightening; as an on-the-road program it was unusual and I particularly enjoyed the "sounds and spirit" which brought unique life to this exploration.
Thank you for celebrating the anniversary of Pentecostalism with a broader audience, especially those of us with little accurate knowledge concerning the religion and many misconceptions. The facts surrounding this global movement were astonishing. It is shameful that a movement with so many followers has been so ignored by religious historians and seminary teachers. Cecil Robeck's comment that it was an "incredible oversight" on their part, embodied commendable diplomacy, I think.
Jessica Ayub
Brooklyn Park, MN (Listens to SOF OnDemand)
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